Siobhan Cunningham served as a member of the US Air Force before transitioning to civilian life, where she discovered how difficult it can be to “fit in” after life in the military. Now she helps veteran women ease their own path as they build businesses that reflect their new identity and purpose after service.

In this episode we discuss:

• Exploring what your new life could look like 
• The benefits of connecting in a supportive community
• Feeling aligned & authentic in a new career
• Balancing life as a new parent or entrepreneur

As a clinical social worker and veteran, Siobhan teaches women who served in the military and other badass leaders in transition into entrepreneurship by using their stories to find community, pursue their mission, and make a difference again. 

Happified listeners can collect Siobhan’s free resource and gain focus on what really matters when starting or growing a business, with the “The Badass Solopreneur’s Resource Guide”

Connect with Siobhan Cunningham online: https://www.linkedin.com/in/siobhandeann/ 

Susi: Welcome back to Happified. I am so excited to be joining you today from the Poditorium. I am here at the fantastic event Podapalooza, where I get to meet extraordinary people making change in the world, like Siobhan Cunningham, who serves women, veteran entrepreneurs and their allies, and supports them in making the change that they need to bring into the world.

And so Siobhan, thank you for joining me.

Siobhan:Thank you so much, Susi, for having me. Such a pleasure to be here. 

Susi: And I would love to hear a little bit about, as I shared with you right before we hopped on the air, I am a – I try to be the best advocate I can be for veterans and people in the service. 

My dad was in the Navy. My brother was in the Army for 18 and a half years, which, you know, there’s always a story in everyone’s service career. But I would love to hear a little bit about you. What is your story with the service and why is this important to you? 

Siobhan: Yeah, Susi. I myself am also a military brat. My dad was in the Army and so I grew up being around military folks and there’s something different about once you’re in and getting that inside information.

So what happened was, I’m a social worker. I’ve been a social worker since high school. And it’s mainly because I love to help and connect people with resources. And so I joined. I ended up joining the Air Force as a social work officer and I, it was a tough time for me because I’m someone who’s really rooted in certainty and planning.

And while you think that the military is very certain, it is in a lot of aspects, but there’s a lot of things that you don’t have control over. And so I had a hard time because I was used to being – I joined at 30, so I was used to having my own freedom, making choices, making quick moves.

And in the military, you just don’t have that muscle. It’s on someone else’s time. And I had a hard time adjusting. So when I got out of the military, I went to go work with veterans, and I was in an inpatient treatment program that I was doing therapy for. 

I noticed that the women veterans still were not speaking up in really taking charge of their treatment.

And I had to think it was the environment. And so, a lot of times the men in inpatient treatment have the spotlight. They are more vocal. And a lot of times the women don’t have that same opportunity for their own reasons. It’s not like bullying or anything. It’s just a back burner situation. Right?

Susi: Somewhat systemic. We might say, we know in many cases we’re raised to be accommodating, non-challenging or threatening, right? The female role traditionally has not been one to advocate for ourselves. And certainly coming out of the military, that’s not a space where, you know, the squeaky wheel gets rewarded. 

Siobhan: Right. Exactly. Yes. And so I noticed that and I was like, women veterans deserve better. We need to do more. And I think that’s why I joined the military, was so I could have this experience because I have an inside knowledge on people sitting in my therapy. Not only saying the same things that the people were saying in the inpatient program, but also that I was experiencing at the time I was in the military, and trying to help them when I’m like, “dang, that’s happening to me too.”

So that’s how I started doing what I do, which is to advocate and let people know that there’s a lot of things about women veterans that don’t fit into the veteran vision that we have, and to help spread the awareness that women veterans are resourceful. They’re resilient. They, a lot of times, don’t identify as veterans.

So, about 2 million women veterans. That’s like one in 65 women. So there’s a very good likelihood that, you know, some veterans who don’t talk about their experience, some women veterans who don’t talk about their experience. And so that’s my message with the allyship. 

Susi: Truly, and I think that’s so interesting too. You’re making me think of another thing that I’ve become aware of through the little, little bit of social support I’ve been able to offer veterans through programs here in the San Diego area. I mean, there’s a lot going on in the San Diego when it comes to military. 

But your point that female veterans don’t typically ask for help, or perhaps fully utilize the resources – And my dad, after his retirement, he worked with Employer Support of Guard and Reserve, which is really essential because if you’re in any of those guard and reserve arrangements, you have to get time away from work and employers don’t always make that easy.

And he pointed out to me this kind of common thread where veterans are reluctant to take advantage of the services that are there to support them. Perhaps because, you know, education and awareness isn’t where we need it to be. They certainly need all the resources that we can give them and more, but also because there’s a point of, you know, “I don’t really need it. Somebody else needs it more than me. If there’s not enough to go around, let me make space for the people who do.” 

And, and that kind of selflessness again, I mean, it is people who are in the service, right? These are service driven individuals. 

And how do you help women in particular see that they deserve these resources, that they do need to speak up for themselves and take advantage, you know, really leverage what’s available.

Siobhan: Yeah. So I address it in kind of three ways. 

One with my mental health background. I like to do check-ins and see how people are just taught how they’re managing their situation. So a lot of times women, when they get out, they find a job. And don’t understand why they’re so miserable at their job, usually it’s because there’s not really a purpose behind that job. There’s not anything to help them work towards. 

So for instance, in the military, you have to make rank. If you don’t make rank, then you get out of the service. And so there are people pushing and supporting and expecting you to do more so you can make your next rank, but in the civilian world, a lot of people just kind of stick to what they’re doing. And if they don’t know the right ways to talk to their corporate boss and their corporate chain of command or corporate ladder, then it can be a problem and they can become stuck. 

And again, like you said, we are people who want to get stuff done. And so a lot of time, what I did, I rage quit like three jobs before I realized that I needed to just do my own thing.

Susi: I might, I might understand exactly what you’re talking about. I have some rage quits in my past too. Yeah. 

Siobhan: I thought something was wrong with me, I was like, why am I getting so angry at all these people? 

Susi: Why can’t I find a job that works for me?

Siobhan: Right. And I realized it wasn’t – Yeah, a lot of it had to do with things that I had been programmed, and I was only in the military for four years. I joined at 30, but I had been programmed in that short time to function a certain way. And so those are things that I like to help women understand, is that this is an actual transition. 

You are different. The world is different. How do we figure out what we want our civilian life to look like? 

And then also, with that, if they’re starting a business or want to join in corporate, I like to create a community and connect. So I have connections with other business people who aren’t military, who are trustworthy and understand the mission of what I do and are willing to help other women veterans start their business or excel in their corporate jobs. 

And then personally, I also really enjoy storytelling as a method of healing, so I like to teach. I healed a lot by writing in anthologies, so I’ve now written in three. And I’ve started collecting people who would be interested in participating in anthologies and then subsequently practice building their brand through that story.

Susi: Yes. Oh, I think it’s so important because so many people don’t recognize or acknowledge that their story, history, herstory is so important. Right? 

And so what a powerful way to connect that to the business that you’re building or the career that you’re looking to step into, you know, to acknowledge where we’ve come from and what we bring to the table because of that, it is truly unique. And so, so important. I love that. We’re definitely going to share that information or your information in the show notes, but can you tell us a website or easy point of access, maybe on LinkedIn, where folks can find you.

Siobhan: On LinkedIn it’s Siobhan Deanne. So my name’s spelled the Irish way. Actually, my name is very Gaelic because my husband is Irish too, but I’m not. So Siobhan Cunningham. Very few black Siobhan Cunninghams exist in the world. And also, you can find me on LinkedIn, Facebook. Siobhan Deanne. 

Susi: Awesome. Beautiful. And we’ll have those links in the show notes too. And I think it’s really terrific because, I’m coming back to what you were saying about, you know, in the military, it’s a very clearly defined path, you know exactly what the next target is, what the next goal is that you’re working towards. It’s the rank or it’s the this, or, you know, this next evaluation, we’re going to be addressing these, right, check in these boxes. And I do feel, even myself not having been in the military, but having different careers and building my own business, it is really hard to get clear on a path or program a system. 

Like how can I get clear on what makes sense next for me? So I love that that’s part of the conversation that you’re bringing to the people you’re working with to help them, because it’s a big shift, to create our own new system, goals, priorities, when we’re used to having that assigned to us. 

Siobhan: Absolutely. Absolutely. Or Being told no and then just having to deal with it, when in the real world, you find a way, right? 

So if I applied for a special assignment in the military and didn’t get it, it’s like, okay. So tell me what else I need to do. Tell me what you want me to do, since I can’t do what I want to do, that’s fine. 

But in the civilian world, in the real world, it’s like, you can make your own way. You can find a way to do what you want to do, but it’s good to have a clear vision of what that is. And that’s the thing you have to create on your own, that we kind of lose that muscle.

Susi: You know, that’s a great way of putting it. Yeah. We haven’t developed that muscle, it takes a little support to get there. A little cheerleading goes a long way too. That’s why I love the way that you’re positioning yourself to be that point of support and resources and real connection place. 

Siobhan: Yes. Yeah. Because I realized I could help with a lot of things, but I had to figure out how am I going to focus on?

Because again, I, as my social work career is very diverse, I could do therapy or I could run a hospital. I could do X, Y, and Z, but ultimately I had to figure out. What do I really want to do? Who do I really want to work with? And what’s going to help me have the lifestyle of taking care. Because I was single in the military.

I got out, got married, have two kids under two, in a very short time period. So I had to really reevaluate everything about my life, because it wasn’t just, now I’m a veteran. It was now I’m a veteran, now I can’t find a job that doesn’t piss me off, now I have a husband to think about, now I’m pregnant.

Like it just kept like, things just kept happening that altered my entire way of living. And within that, I’m still trying to figure out, okay, how am I gonna make money?  

Susi: Right, right. How do we, how do we get that green energy flowing, and it is always evolving. I think that’s a really important thing to recognize too, you know, certainly in the conversations that I have with people about stress, they’re like, “okay, so we take care of it and that’s it.”

I’m like, “no, no, no, no. It’s never about the destination. It’s always about the journey.” Like don’t ever think you’re going to get there and you’re going to sit back and relax, because that’s not what we get to aim for, sadly or not. 

The adventure is in coming back to it daily, letting it evolve and accommodate what else life brings us.

Like you say, I mean, you probably couldn’t have pictured a five year plan that would take you from where you were to where you find yourself now, right? And, you know, my hat is always off to the Mamas. You just take it on, find a way, keep stepping forward, you know, fitting in what’s important. 

And I do think it is important, and again, that’s why I love your advocacy, to learn how to put ourselves first. 

I think, particularly for veterans and then certainly for women, you know, those two groups, but then when you combine them into a focus group it’s hard to put ourselves first. We’re used to taking care of everyone else. It’s “easy” for us to make accommodations and do what other people ask us to.

But then we find ourselves not on our own schedule, right? Not doing the little things that help keep us on track. Is that something that, do you have any tips there for folks?

Siobhan: So being a parent, a new parent of two, who, both of them are crying right now. Like literally. No, it’s fine though.

But again, from someone who liked to be very orderly and certain about what we’re doing, what my schedule is to do this, how I’m doing this, I had to let go of some of that perfection, some of that order. And exist in the chaos, right? 

And so, like I knew this was something that I had to do, you know, and I know if my kids are crying, they’re breathing.

Susi: Good tip, Mama. Come back to that. 

“They’re okay. They’re still breathing.” Yeah, it would be okay for one more minute. 

Siobhan: Yes. And so, but that is it, for me, it’s the kiddos. But for someone else, it could be, I’m used to having X amount of money in the bank, and now I’m not, I’m used to achieving my goals and now I’m not.

And it’s understanding that you are different, your situation is different. And this is an adjustment. It really is. It isn’t just the transition of walking across the bridge from like, I was active duty to now I’m not. It really is a transition of understanding yourself and where you fit in this new space that you’re in and this new world that you’re in.

Susi: Mm, mm-hmm and giving ourselves grace, while we let that all take shape. 

Siobhan: Lots of grace. And you can cry. You can feel bad, but get over it, you know, like keep on moving forward.

Susi: Yes. Beautiful. Thank you so much. I want to let you relieve those little kiddos that have been so patient with us. I’m glad I caught you during their nap time to start out with! 

Siobhan: Thank you so much, Susie. I appreciate your patience.

Susi: It has been a treat. I’m so glad that we were connected and I look forward to staying connected. Please keep us posted over here in the Happified community on anything you have coming up. And I’ll definitely have those links in the show notes.

Anybody who wants to connect with Siobhan and learn how they can get support, or they can help and be advocates and allies for our ladies, our women coming out of the service and how we can keep making good change in the world.

Siobhan: Thank you so much. And I’m glad to be a part of the Happified community.

Susi: Yes! Welcome. Take good care of yourself. Talk to you soon. 

Siobhan: Thank you. Bye.